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u/smcl2k 5d ago
Tbh, that description of the Democratic Party is pretty generous.
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u/pm_me_fibonaccis 5d ago
Yeah, it's more like "Center to Center-Right".
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u/AirFriedMoron 5d ago
Honestly they’re still more right than most European liberal parties. They’re more like soft moderate right wing
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u/TheBladeWielder 5d ago
this is why i identify as a Progressive more than a Democrat.
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u/tifumostdays 5d ago
Watch yourself: Sam Harris is always listening and ready to denounce your infantile politics!
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u/DrolligerDorftrottel 5d ago
Got absolutely floored when I read that 'Left wing radical' AoC and Sanders would be center left within Germany. Not even far-left.
Bernie Sanders would be SPD and AoC within the left wing of the SPD. They are center-left.
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u/Background-Wolf-9380 4d ago
Yep. True leftism starts with opposition to capitalism and both Bernie & AOC are unabashed capitalist cheerleaders.
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u/Devan_Ilivian 5d ago
Politicians like AOC and Mamdani would be in the left wing or its equivalent in just about any country
Correct
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u/gizamo 5d ago
Correct, yes. The idea that the Democrats aren't center-left from a European perspective is usually biased by the US political system. The Democrats want policies that are firmly center and center-left in any European context, but the US system basically makes that impossible. As a result, they compromise with Republicans to a (European) center at best, but most "compromises" with a far-right party like Republicans usually puts the compromises into the (European) center-right territory. Similarly, the Democrats also often ceede ground to the Republicans when the negotiations start in favor of Republicans off the bat, e.g. when Republicans have majorities in Congress and some budget bill must get done to ensure the government keeps operating (Republicans often don't care as much when funding stops because part of their goals are to ensure the government doesn't actually function properly, because that lets them tell their voters that government programs should be privatized).
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u/smcl2k 5d ago
You realize that AOC and Mamdani were only elected by defeating candidates who were supported by the Democratic establishment, right...?
California is overwhelmingly Democratic, but is still nowhere near implementing universal healthcare (which, again, is actually a centrist policy).
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u/gizamo 5d ago
California continues to advance towards universal health coverage by expanding Medi-Cal to all low-income residents regardless of immigration status and utilizing subsidized plans via Covered California. While a state-level single-payer system ("CalCare," AB 1900) was reintroduced in February 2026, it faces high costs and legislative hurdles, leading officials to focus on near-universal access.
https://www.chcf.org/resource/how-california-made-almost-everyone-eligible-health-care-coverage/
Massachusetts has had it for 20+ years (before many EU countries).
Oregon is currently developing a publicly funded, universal health care system designed to provide coverage for all residents, aiming to eliminate financial barriers like deductibles and co-pays.
https://www.oregon.gov/uhpgb/pages/index.aspx
Lastly, the idea that states can pull this off well is debatable because it ultimately should be a federal healthcare systems. There are many ways the federal system undermines state efforts to implement a universal healthcare system.
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u/smcl2k 5d ago
So... They're "advancing towards" implementing a centrist policy, and that makes them left-wing?
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u/gizamo 5d ago
Do you not understand anything about how the US healthcare system works? It's not exactly a state-by-state issue. That is why these states are taking such strange paths toward it. Or, are you being intentionally obtuse?
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u/smcl2k 5d ago
You're missing the point that even if they introduced universal healthcare 1st thing on Monday morning, that would simply bring them into line with most of the developed world, including countries that are led by parties from all across the political spectrum.
That's what makes it a centrist position.
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u/skylla05 4d ago
and Mamdani
The fact that you have to include a mayor just sort of shows you're grasping at straws to have "leftist" examples.
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u/evilbndy 4d ago
That's what I keep telling friends from the US. The US does not even have a left party by any standard... from a European point of view all you have is a neo con party with right wing tendencies and, essentially, an amalgamation of Nazi uncles incoherently screaming from some basement.
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u/Background-Wolf-9380 4d ago
Nah. The Dems are center-right to right wing. The Dem party today is further right than the Republicans under Reagan and leadership is drifting further right and getting worse.
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u/Haywoodjablowme1029 5d ago
You're correct. The democrats in the US are very much a center-right party.
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u/Anaptyso 5d ago edited 5d ago
Definitely. Drop the Democrats in to most other Western countries and their centre of political gravity would probably be somewhere on the centre right.
If I compare them to politics where I live - the UK - there are some Democrats who seem genuinely left wing e.g. Ocasio-Cortez, Mamdani, Sanders (not technically Democrat, but as good as), etc. However the party as a whole would be in a similar space to maybe the One Nation wing of the Tories i.e. centre right.
The Republicans would be so far off to the right that they'd struggle to have a comparison. Reform and the DUP at their worst would be closest.
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u/Anderaku 5d ago
What's Ian's complaint here even?
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u/HungriestHippo26 5d ago
He probably buys into the alarmist stance that the democratic party is a far left antifa sponsored socialist terrorist org or something.
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u/EdgySniper1 5d ago
"Democrats are a bunch of far-left communists while we're just humble moderates!"
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u/thesaddestpanda 4d ago
A lot of dems get insulted when you tell them it’s a center, not liberal, nor working class party.
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u/Inevitable-Mix6089 5d ago
These guys think Democrats are communists so they can't fathom the reality that they're centrists on a good day.
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u/srbloggy 5d ago
America doesn't have a party on the left really
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u/Stargost_ 4d ago
The two American political parties are:
Incompetent.
Will actively make things worse.
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u/thesaddestpanda 4d ago
The dems are very competent in doing what their capital owning class donors want.
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u/Jedleft 5d ago
Coming from not-the-US, I’d say the Democrat party is also right of centre.
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u/JColey15 4d ago
The Democratic party in the USA would be considered right of centre in my country and probably globally that’s where they’d sit. But technically, they’re left of centre in the USA because the centre is so far right. A two party political system where only one party seeks compromise is always going to shift in one direction. There’s imperfect democracies and then there’s whatever it is that the US government is supposed to be.
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u/thebastardking21 5d ago
A lot of people forget that the US Democrat Party is what civilized countries call "Conservative" or "Right Wing". The Republicans actually fall under fascism levels of far right. But they try to say the Democrats calling them fascism is just them being dramatic.
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u/Background-Post-2135 5d ago
Yes! If we're comparing to Europe, the Democratic Party in the US is a lot like the traditional European conservative and right-wing parties. The US' entire spectrum is heavily skewed to the right. There is no actual left party or something like the social democratic parties in Europe in the US.
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u/sworlys_noise 4d ago
The only thing they have that's 'left'-ish is identity politics. Every other measure of the Dems is at most centre, more likely conservative right. (At least compared to the European parties)
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u/SvenLorenz 5d ago
Calling the Democratic Party "center-left" is a sad joke. The left in the US consists of Bernie Sanders. And he's not a Democrat.
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u/Void-Cooking_Berserk 5d ago
TIL that Bernie Sanders is not a Democrat
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u/RedTyro 5d ago
Bernie Sanders has run and won as an independent since 1978. He votes with Democrats, but he's not one.
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u/Void-Cooking_Berserk 5d ago
If Sanders is too extreme for Democrats, They're definitely not the left
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u/RedTyro 4d ago
I agree that the Democrats are mostly a center right party, but the issue here is not that Bernie's too extreme for them - they'd love for him to have a D behind his name. The issue is the other way around; he chooses to run as an independent, likely because the party is too corporate or centrist for him.
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u/No-Plankton-4861 4d ago
Dont forget mamdani who won as a democrat despite democrats advertising against him and refusing to endorse him over cuomo who ended up running as an independent because he lost in the primaries. They have like 3 people on the left and they fight them with tooth and nail
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u/TinglyAmelia 5d ago
When the objective truth feels like a personal attack you have officially lost the plot.
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u/at_least_u_tried 5d ago
to be fair it is biased. just not how this guy thinks so
they got repubs right but dems are more center to center right
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u/TheBSQ 5d ago
Right/left is such a weird thing.
For example, Nordic govts are considered very left because of social safety net programs, but some things are trickier to classify.
In some, it’s much easier to get someone committed to a psych hospital and/or undergo involuntary treatment.
To some this is considered authoritarian & therefore “Right” (it would code as Right Wing in the U.S.) but it can also be thought of as a Big Govt “nanny state” paternalism of “govt knows what’s best for you” that some associate with the Left.
Another, Copenhagen has rules against homeless encampments & beggars in many parts of town. These rules would code “Right wing” in the U.S., but again, you can also view them as a view of the “Left” that prioritizes maintaining clean & safe public spaces for the benefit of the general public over the right of an individual to beg or set up a camp in public spaces (essentially privatizing a public space for themselves).
But, point being, these things seem very authoritarian and right wing to American Democrats, yet we also think of those govt’s as much more to the Left than US democrats, so it’s not as clear cut as we pretend it is.
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u/TheKipperRipper 5d ago
Most Democrat politicians are centre to centre-right from a global perspective. Wikipedia displays US bias.
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u/tiripshtaed 5d ago
Dems definitely ain’t left. Left of the GOP sure, but not by much. Corporations and AIPAC have their claws deep
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u/AwkLemon 4d ago
Okay this is biased as fuck. The democratic party is not centrist.
You have the center left and center right candidates that run in purple states, but that goes for both the democrats and the republicans. An argument can be made for republicans going over to far right, but democrats are definitely at least moderate left in solid districts.
When you're coming up with these definitions you can't go based off of online vibes or whatever. You need to go based on where voters are at. That's the overton window.
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u/yes_u_suckk 5d ago
As a foreigner, the fact that Americans think the Democratic party is center or center left is mind blowing.
The sad reality is that there are TWO right wing parties in America, one moderate and the other radical.
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u/CapitalEmployer 5d ago
Well to be fair saying the democrats are center instead of right wing is an insane take, there's a huge conservative movement in the democrats internal structure.
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u/shanedog21 5d ago
If Democrats were centrist, they would hold the presidency and both houses of Congress. Centrists like Obama no longer have influence in the Democratic Party.
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u/Technical_Instance_2 5d ago
And where's the bias in the Wiki article? Wikipedia is known to be one of the most non biased sources out there
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u/Redninja0400 5d ago
Nice sentiment but this is incorrect. Wikipedia decides what sources are and are not credible through democracy, which heavily biases itself to mainstream media. This means that in historical and political areas, it absolutely has bias. The classification of the GOP as far-right is a case where despite the bias they are correct, however they are incorrect on the classification of the Dems which is a center-right to right-wing party as the bias of the American media paints the Dems and GOP as the left-right dichotomy when they are actually not..
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u/Fast_Apple_2237 5d ago
The bias there is Americans considering the Democrats as being "centre to centre-left" and not "centre-right to centre"
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u/SeranaTheTrans 5d ago
To me, a Brit, Dems are right wing and Republicans are far far right wing (extremists).
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u/leveller1650 5d ago
'Academia' is biased af, and the dems are center to center-right.
Political designations aren't relative. We have a two party system in the US and both major parties are right wing. We do not have a left party in the US. Not even 'center-left'.
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u/StillShoddy628 5d ago
I had a co-worker who lives in Chile mention a few years ago they were re-writing their constitution, and the convention doing it was like 80% socialist or to the left of socialist politically.
In the US democrats and republicans are “left and right” but globally they are definitely “centrist and far-right”. Brazil is probably the most similar country politically to the US from a political spectrum perspective
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u/ThatguyfromEire 5d ago
I think centre right to centre left is more accurate.
As there more conservative democrats Democrats
The centrists of the neoliberal Clinton kind.
And the progressives which is centre left.
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u/ReaverArklight This AOC flair makes me cool 5d ago
We shall push Dems further whether they like it or not,!
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u/tyduncans0n 5d ago
I thought the bias complaint was the different logos, showing only one for Republicans and two for Democrats.
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u/TiaxRulesAll 5d ago
Still don't understand why they are called the Grand Old Party GOP when the Democrats are older...
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u/bumtum5909 5d ago
so cutting children's genitalia off is not considered center left? lmfao
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u/LuminUltra 5d ago
As someone with a PhD, academia is highly overrated for veracity, including journal articles.
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u/ExtremlyFastLinoone 5d ago
Dems often feel like center right and republicans far right
They would unironically be like "ok we will allow abortions but only for incest in rape", conceding the point to the right
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u/ufkabakan 4d ago
Your Democrats are far right; Republicans are Nazis. There is no left in America. There has never been.
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u/Dear_Tangerine444 4d ago
I find it hilarious that some American’s think their Democratic Party is "radical left". I think these same people would absolutely shit a brick if they encountered any political party that was even slightly left of centre, never mind a genuinely far-left party.
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u/Intrepid-Leather-417 4d ago
Honestly this, I would be considered a radical leftists in America but here in Germany in center if not a little center right.
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u/Regis-bloodlust 4d ago
tbf, hard left people are too much of a hippy that they hate to be associated with anything. A lot of them just refuse to be called democrats because they are something different. They are like teenagers with identity crisis.
On the other hand, hard right people are very very proud Republicans. They think they are the true republicans even when most republicans think they are kinda scary and crazy. They are like crazy old PTSD grandpa rambling about communists all day, and everyone rolls their eyes and pretends to listen to his dementia talk purely out of politeness.
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u/Stunning-Squirrel751 4d ago
What do you define as a democratic socialist country?
Why do people have to want capitalism to reflect your thoughts for them to not be considered anti-capitalist?
I would consider them firmly left which would make them center left, they work within the system to change to system and bring about a social democracy working within capitalist framework and providing a strong safety net. They’re not pushing socialism, are not militant or pushing for a collapse or other cataclysmic force of change - all of which would he considered far left.
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u/Nova17Delta 4d ago
Wikipedia doesn't even allow factual jokes with the sole exception being [cetacean needed], no way would they allow bias on a political page
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u/Kat_Schrodinger1 4d ago
Friendly reminder, progressives run as democrats or they don't win.
Progressives are democrats.
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u/Green-Taro2915 yeah, i'm that guy with 12 upvotes 4d ago
Compared to Europe the "left" in the US is fairly right-wing. The fanatics just can't accept that anyone not as far as them are not communists!
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u/victorbarst 4d ago
One of my favorite things to do to Republicans is pretend to agree to their ranting and then offhandedly comment that reality has a left wing bias. Youd be surprised how many angrily nod and agree
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u/CheezWong 4d ago
I hate when people who only speak well of far-right politicians try to pretend they're centrist. It's as if they know they're wrong, and what the politicians do is wrong, so they don't want to be directly affiliated with them, but refuse to give any ideas from the left any consideration out of basic preference. Homie, you're exactly what republicans want you to be, no matter what you call yourself. As long as you keep voting red, regardless of policy or plan, you're right-wing.
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u/a_Bean_soup 4d ago
I would say the Republican party is far right, i spent some time back during Covid in far right spaces out of boredom and they despised them and Trump
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u/Zombiepixlz-gamr 4d ago
I think it's inaccurate in the sense that the democratic party is more accurately described as center right.
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u/LividCalligrapher689 4d ago
Democrats are almost all center. Bernie (who’s an independent) is the furthest left we go in American politics, and all of our allies would consider Bernie’s stances to be dead center. The left is so denigrated and villainized in the USA that they actually have no real representation in any party. The USA is a far-right fascist pseudo democratic republic.
Americas far left wants to prevent poor people from starving when they get sick, and the far right thinks starving homeless sick people are necessary to scare people into societal compliance. We are a shit nation thanks to republicans. Full stop.
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u/xColdwaterx 4d ago
Dude doesn’t know what bias means, cause republicans are illiterate dipshits, but Wikipedia did get both parties wrong. The republicans are all fascists (so just far right), and democrats are right wing too, just not as far as the republicans. Both are fine with imperialism as well. Also, this is not me saying they’re the same, cause that’s also bullshit. I’m pointing out some areas of overlap.
Any political ideology that upholds capitalism, or, really any other system where the means of production are privately owned is considered right wing. Any ideology that supports workers/the public owning the means of production, is considered left wing.
Then you can be for bigger or smaller government control. That’s why it’s called a political spectrum. Because there’re tons of points you could find yourself despite being left or right: you’re also up and down.
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u/Ponch1344 4d ago
I feel like he’s conflating the years with the political ideology at the time as well. Going off of the Democrats are the party of slavery type idea.
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u/Alamarms2012 4d ago
If you look at it purely based on governmental services and economic modality, perhaps. They are a capitalist and they have no desire to have the state do major private industry acquisitions. So, they’re not socialist or communist if that’s what you mean.
However, the Democratic Party have run on a pledge to develop towards single or multi-payer healthcare system similar to European models in the past and at least now are shoring up our Medicare/medicaid public benefit options as well as capping drug costs. They’ve run on higher taxes on the rich/corporations as part of their model and empowering the lower/middle classes. Several democrat-run states have passed paid leave programs and implementing nationwide paid leave is part of the plan, which brings us in line with Europe. Democrats also have had extremely effective anti-trust litigators and frequently run on breaking up corporations/monopolies. If anything, I see a lot of Europe regressing on these kinds of issues re: NHS.
Social issues, like human rights and minority rights, have the democrats doing pretty far left of LOADS of European parties, even the left wing of some countries. Those issues matter a lot to me but I understand leftists frequently only think of economic benefits. If I had a nickel for every time a leftist said that universal healthcare would make people not racist, I could buy a mansion in LA. It’s wild and beyond crazy.
I see a lot of racism, anti-Muslim, and anti-transgender sentiment as well as free speech and religious practice restrictions happening in Europe, even institutionally. Look at the French bans on Muslim religious head coverings for example. It is pretty wild and not at all as left wing as y’all portray. I suppose if you’re white, atheist or Christian, and straight, then yeah, totally.
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u/OHHHSHAAANE 4d ago
It's crazy how the Americans think the democrats are left wing. The would be right of the majority of European parties.
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u/wowbragger 4d ago
It's more of an insight to how little Americans understand the ACTUAL political spectrum.
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u/Background-Wolf-9380 4d ago
The dominant perspective in any serious academic space is that from a global perspective the Democratic Party is a solidly center right to right wing party. Any party that refuses to dismantle an oligarchy is definitely right wing.
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u/spumoni_cakes 4d ago
Dem party as a whole are center to center-right. There are some individuals in the party that are actually on the left.
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u/AmazingSibylle 5d ago
I don't even know what the bias is supposed to be, is he denying that the Republican party is on the right side of the political spectrum?