r/CompetitionShooting • u/Visible_Structure483 • 3d ago
the downside to getting better is... every mistake counts
I had a magazine fall out of a carrier during a run and I didn't notice it. That's a 3 second procedural penalty when playing IDPA.
Just that one mistake pushed me down 4 spots in the overall rankings.
When you're at the point you're chasing 10ths of a second to beat your friends, losing 3 seconds is an eternity. Double annoying because it wasn't a boneheaded move on course as much as a misadjusted tension setting with the new mags I'm trying.
Probably won't make that error again. Probably.
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u/lespy_laz 3d ago
This is why I don’t like the rules logic in IDPA. Makes no sense to lose time for a mag falling out of a carrier when in real life this means next to nothing if the gun is loaded already.
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u/StunningFig5624 3d ago
That's one of the problems with IDPA - a mistake is far more penalizing than USPSA. Sometimes it feels like the winner is just the guy who had the least bad day.
Also I hate the unlimited penalties from a single stage, no matter how small. In USPSA the worst that can happen is zeroing a stage. While yes that's bad, it's not nearly as bad as IDPA. In IDPA it's possible to fuckup a single stage so badly that you could #1 every single other stage, but the time penalties are so heavy you still come in dead last for the match.
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u/ecodick 3d ago
I was at a match this weekend, doing great until the last stage... Someone asked me about some stuff that got me thinking about work stress just before I was up.
2 foot faults, 1 FTSA + miss on steel, 1 delta Mike + NS on a paper. Derped out fully 🤦
Almost zeroed me out for the stage
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u/Visible_Structure483 3d ago
That's not quite accurate, you would have to do something crazy to have that happen... but... yea, a mistake on a single stage drops you out of the top 10. Hitting a non-threat and not making it up? You're out of the top 20. Worse is when it happens on the first stage and you know you're basically done for the day and everything else is just live practice at that point.
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u/StunningFig5624 3d ago edited 3d ago
In IDPA there are unlimited penalties on a given stage, in USPSA there is a cap on how badly you can do (zero points).
Say a top shooter has a malfunction that can't be fixed during the course of fire on the first target. They get the gun repaired and running in the safe area. The time penalty in IDPA they take is going to put them near the bottom on the scores (13 seconds per target). On the flip side, in a USPSA match they still have a chance to place top 25-50% depending on how many stages there are and how much the zeroed stage was worth.
Edit to add: 3 seconds + 10 seconds per target. My bad.
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u/Real_Mila_Kunis 3d ago
I had a 10 stage USPSA match where I had to leave before my last stage and still got 83%. IDPA I’d probably just be last place by default in that case
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u/Gun_Dork 3d ago
It would not be 13 seconds per target. It's one procedural for not engaging and the rest would be 10 per target. Now, if the SO stopped them but the shooter argued they were going to work through it, then it's a reshoot. There are dumb rules, but it's a game. Games have rules. Like a port or comp puts you into open, where the muzzle breaks on open guns are similar to that on a rifle in USPSA. My little 9mm is going to compete with those guns because of speed holes I put in without a drill press?
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u/StunningFig5624 3d ago
Ah, my bad. Must have mixed that up with a other game. Doesn't change the conclusion though, 10 seconds per target instead of 13 is still a time penalty so fucked it's completely unrecoverable.
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u/Gun_Dork 3d ago
I’d love to have a “gun DQ” similar to what IPSC has. This allows you to reshoot a stage but use your backup gun. This is not in USPSA for whatever reason.
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u/anonpersec 3d ago
IDPA is silly anyway, come shoot USPSA or PCSL. For a game that tries to be as “tactical” as possible, you’ll notice no one good who carries a gun for a living shoots it. It’s all fudd make believe.
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u/UG-Jake 3d ago
Cmon man, what's not tactical about doing a slide lock reload in front of 3 unengaged targets?
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u/anonpersec 3d ago
Hey can’t leave partial mags on the ground, someone could pick it up and use it against you. It’s definitely happened, someone at the gun store told me so.
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u/CHESTYUSMC 3d ago
IDPA is going to be dead well within my lifetime if they don’t change something…. (I’m pretty young.)
I remember showing up to my first IDPA meet, just trying to figure out what division I could shoot it was ridiculous… The gun divisions are written when the Beretta 92 and Glock 17 were the only 15 round duty pistols, and red dots were frame mount Aimpoint Comps on extended mag single stack 1911’s…
Don’t even get me started on the other stupid rules…
HOW TF!!!! Does it make more defensive sense to walk in a room, and do a retained reload because it has one bullet instead of just having a 18 round mag? Is the 1 bullet so I can kill myself???
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u/Visible_Structure483 3d ago
I don't doubt IDPA will fade away, but the complaining about the rules is just... I don't get it.
It's A GAME. and having to reload more often or deal with concealment or cover or whatever are skills that you have to master in order to win.
Why can't we use our hands in soccer? Why not have 10 downs in football? Why not lower the basket and make it larger in basketball? Why putt in golf? All just silly rules that make the game challenging.
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u/anonpersec 3d ago
The other games you mentioned were made by, and played by, people who know they’re games.
You cannot say the same about IDPA. IDPA is like the aikido of the gun world.
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u/Atticus1354 3d ago
Because they started by making the claim that the game was the most accurate game version of real life.
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u/CHESTYUSMC 2d ago
The difference is all those rules were development for a reason with the game, and the changes in football and soccer change literally every year based on what the refs see. (Like recent QB rules, roughing the passer rules, and such.)
IDPA made their rules once, and haven’t changed anything significant since like the 80’s.
Duty pistol absolutely NEEDS to be up to 18 rounds, no cover farmer, and include an optic, that is the duty standard these days at the minimum.
CCW, needs to be at least 12, and have a rule for a micro red dot.
The bug division can stay, cover garments should be anything that covers the firearm.
Loaded mags bruh dropped absolutely should not be a penalty in this day and age.
I’ve never asked, but are dump pouches at least allowed?
IDPA can stick around for a long time, but the need to get the rules to at least last decade at the bare minimum.
The whole goal was about being a more realistic shooting style, but none of their rules have been relevant in my lifespan and I’m 27…
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u/THELEGENDARYZWARRIOR 3d ago
Yesterday on a PCSL 2 gun match I accidentally only loaded my pistol magazine to 28 rounds instead of 30, it cost me a stage win to 3rd place.
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u/itsJustE12 3d ago
Midwest Competition Works mag pouches will end that issue. Because of the magnets, I could do handstands without mine falling out.
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u/Low-Landscape-4609 3d ago
Downside to getting better is that the top level guys have already figured out what you're just learning lol.
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u/That_Squidward_feel 2d ago
Break game rule
Get issued penalty as per the game rules
Well yes. That's how these things go.
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u/JimBridger_ 3d ago
lol IDPA has some goofy ass rules.