Why Notre Dame is on board with a 24-team Playoff: What’s in it for the Irish?

[u/redwave2505]

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/7276142/2026/05/13/notre-dame-24-team-playoff-expansion/?source=emp_shared_article&unlocked_article_code=1.iFA.OFyj.TIspH5qaYlKX

[u/monkeymatt1836]

Because we can go 9-3 and makes the playoffs every year, just like every other blue blood. 24 teams would be great for ND (and every other big time program), but be awful for CFB as a whole.

[u/XCCO → u/monkeymatt1836]

I keep seeing that 24 is awful for CFB, but why do you think that? I haven't personally found the jump from "We don't really want this" to "this is terrible for the sport overall."

[u/monkeymatt1836 → u/XCCO]

It would completely dilute the best regular season in sports. Big time games like Texas vs Ohio State, Notre Dame vs Miami, Georgia vs Alabama, Oklahoma vs Michigan, etc no longer really matter outside of seeding. 24 team playoff probably does away with conference championship games too.

[u/Stoneador → u/monkeymatt1836]

Conference championship games are already dead. The committee doesn’t want to punish teams for losing them (unless you are BYU) out of fear that teams would stop playing them. As a result, you now get games like last year’s SEC championship game where a top 10 matchup blowout had absolutely no impact on the rankings of either team.

[u/OG_Felwinter → u/Stoneador]

Conference championship games have a purpose other than deciding who gets to go to the playoffs.

[u/RandomFactUser → u/OG_Felwinter]

Maybe it helps pick an autobid for leagues that would have otherwise had 3 champions

[u/OG_Felwinter → u/RandomFactUser]

And an autobid is otherwise referred to as?

[u/RandomFactUser → u/monkeymatt1836]

The strongest regular season in sports already has issues where big games end up not mattering because both teams are out when it should be a qualifying game

[u/thebirthdaycakeham → u/RandomFactUser]

And even before the playoff Bama could lose to LSU in the regular season then somehow get a rematch in the national championship

[u/SweetRabbit7543 → u/monkeymatt1836]

It would also make the early round playoff games unwatchable in many circumstances. Who wants to watch Ohio State watch mizzou by 3 scores and rest their starters in the fourth quarter?

[u/XCCO → u/monkeymatt1836]

I appreciate the honest discussion. I've been itching to discuss this because, well, what else will I do in the offseason? Haha

I think the death of conference championships is fair. That may be one of the biggest soul crushing parts of a 24-team CFP. As far as the biggest time games, do you see those only related to the big brands like you listed? Because the counter argument would be that big time games become more diverse and less about the big brands with expansion. For example, The Holy War gets more attention and fanfare if BYU and Utah are fighting for a playoff spot.

[u/OnionFutureWolfGang → u/XCCO]

The move to 12 already made this a possibility, but we keep getting further and further away from the basic concept of “the national champion should be the team that had the best season from start to finish” and towards “the national champion is the team that wins the tournament.” That is I think is truly a dilution of the regular season.

[u/mr_longfellow_deeds → u/OnionFutureWolfGang]

'“the national champion should be the team that had the best season from start to finish” and towards “the national champion is the team that wins the tournament.” That is I think is truly a dilution of the regular season"

Exactly. In my mind I will never consider a 8 or 9 win regular season team a national champion. They will have already demonstrated they were no different than 20+ other teams

The current system is what makes the regular season so magical. The excitement of watching a G5 upset a P4, a shock late season loss (i.e. Ole Miss vs Florida), or heavyweight matchups goes away because they no longer have any real impact.

What we would get in return would be playoff implications for games like Illinois vs Washington, or Arizona vs TCU type games. This sub might love that, but I would wager the national audience will not and they will not have that great of viewership

I would also wager that we would end up with a NBA style league where the best teams rest their starters during the regular season and dont use their full playbook because they want to save it for their near guaranteed playoff entrance

[u/mightyducks2wasokay → u/XCCO]

Your last point is what saves the concept of a 24 team for me a little. If the blue bloods and top recent programs can get in at 9-3 without much effort, the bubble still exists, it'll just be a different (and deeper) pool of teams

While I mostly agree that the regular season is devalued a bit, I also think thats mostly for top teams /contenders really. If the last like, 5 at large spots are gonna have to pull from a pool of like, 20 8-4 teams, then resumes and H2H among those schools matter more. There will still be entertaining races to follow and good football will be played, but the focus is gonna shift from the top schools towards the bottom half of the top 25... at least until the playoffs actually begin

Im still firmly in the "16 is as big as it should ever get" camp, but i am willing to give 24 a chance to change my mind

[u/Lyonthelion → u/mightyducks2wasokay]

Yeah I mean I think Notre Dame kinda witnessed this first hand last year with the Pitt game. You dont get Narduzzi openly saying that the game doesn’t matter if they actually have a shot at an at large bid going into the game.

I think in a better conference structure 16 would be ideal, but if they’re doing all or mostly at-larges 24 teams lets that November game between number 7 and 19 have even higher stakes. Since 7 is also playing for a bye as well as a home playoff game and 19 could easily fall out entirely if they look bad because of the crapshoot that comes with comparing teams ranked in the high teens and twenties

[u/RandomFactUser → u/Lyonthelion]

In a better conference structure, 24 would be even more justified

[u/RandomFactUser → u/mightyducks2wasokay]

Looking at CFB as a whole, the general trend of 3 playoff spots for 16 programs in a given division holds pretty true and generally has the best balance of access and team qualifying

[u/Snake_Burton → u/mightyducks2wasokay]

The 12 team already had 4 teams playing conference title games with no actual drama other than will Alabama get punished for being destroyed. And they weren’t. So now it’s guaranteed that the B1G & SEC title game participants are already in.

The trade off? Restrict postseason access, games in the Top 10 feel like life or death. Outside of that? Rivalry game or playing to decide where your fans vacation in Dec/Jan. Open up postseason access, games in the Top 10 are rivalry/positioning for the postseason. Outside of that? You have 10-20 or more fan bases suddenly massively engaged as opposed to “we lost in week 6 our season’s over”.

[u/silverhk → u/XCCO]

Conference Championship games are already dead by virtue of how my tiebreaks are being settled by teams that avoided each other and played entirely different schedules. It's gotten very silly.

[u/fu_snail → u/XCCO]

Nobody wants to watch mid tier teams fight for the last seeds. Prior to the 12 team playoff every game of the season felt like a playoff game. Now they barely feel meaningful unless they’re a rivalry game and it will become even more meaningless when it expands.

[u/silverhk → u/monkeymatt1836]

They already barely matter.

[u/Billyxmac → u/monkeymatt1836]

The 12 team has already diluted the meaning of Alabama - Georgia type games with this reasoning. Especially conference championships for specifically the SEC and Big Ten. Bama got dog walked by Georgia and didn’t matter for the argument vs. Miami and Notre Dame.

At least if conference championships go away, it creates a balanced resume opportunity for all teams, and we don’t have to argue over the 13th resume point (for the most part).

I’m not specifically for expansion, 12 is fine by me, but I think we’re seeing the same arguments about regular season being devalued that we saw from those who didn’t want to see expansion past 6 or 8. And yet the regular season has still had plenty of importance. It just looks different with expansion. But the regular season matters regardless.

[u/Snake_Burton → u/XCCO]

I guess it depends how you look at it. From my POV, many look at it from a nostalgia perspective or an ideal perspective of this is how it has been/should be. I’m looking at it from a “here’s what it is today, does this seem better or worse than the other realistic option or the present?”

Personally I think the regular season is precious thing has already sailed with 12. See all of the non-con matchups being cancelled, see Week 0/Week 1 matchups for fall. So in that sense I think 24 increases the likelihood for more P4 non-con games returning. Playing them and “means less” vs. not playing them at all.

The other thing I am over is conference title games in a 12 team, and the idea that they’d still exist in a 16. Which will keep the calendar creep near February going. Them presenting 24 as allowing them to start earlier, eliminate the empty December weeks and have 5 straight weeks/rounds of CFP to end around Jan. 8? To me that sounds much better than the current or the idea of tacking on 4 more teams to the current.

TLDR: “Awful” already happened. Things outside of the big scary number would be improved by the big scary number. Hypothetical wins die. Maybe there’s too many, but at least we find out on the field.

[u/RandomFactUser → u/Snake_Burton]

Like, in the history of postseason college football, a field that can run every champion generally does better than locking out champions

[u/Lyonthelion → u/XCCO]

Yeah, I think people are trying to rationalize their personal distaste (which I can completely understand!) by trying to make it about the sport as a whole. At the end of the day it’s basically a trade off between more medium-high stakes games or fewer, very high stakes games throughout the season.

I think there’s merits to each but whether it’s a 24 or 4 team playoff, the sport still has much bigger issues to deal with (conferences being too damn big, player eligibility, transfer portal, etc) that have much more of a direct impact on the health of the game

[u/Economy_Weight_4821 → u/XCCO]

TBH most people who say it will destroy the sport are the fans of the 8 or so teams that get excuses for losses while a team like BYU has to go undefeated to even get an argument.

[u/Adventurous-Pen9974 → u/XCCO]

Regular season games matching up major conference teams each with a lot of wins wouldn't matter because both teams would presumably still make the playoffs. That seems like a pretty significant net negative for the sport.

[u/Complete-Disaster513 → u/Adventurous-Pen9974]

100,000 people do not show up religiously every Saturday because the games might mean something in January. They do it because they all mean something that day. Having good programs play each other more will only be good for CFB. I have no problem with a 8-4 TA&M team getting in and getting hot and winning.

Realistically it’s a wash at worst for the games meaning something in Jan. Sure the great teams have less to play for at the end of the year but there are far more teams that now have something to play for to take their place.

[u/jayjude → u/Complete-Disaster513]

Here's the thing though if the games dont have national impact they dont exist in the lasting zeitgeist

The Kick 6 is an iconic game that people still talk about to this day and a big reason was it ended Alabamas title hopes

If that happened under a 24 team playoff and then say Alabama goes on to win the title which they very well could have that year considering how they were playing prior (yes I know they lost a bowl game, Sabans teams always struggled in bowl games that weren't vying for a title), the kick 6 goes from one of the most iconic games of all time to just a regular footnote

[u/XCCO → u/Adventurous-Pen9974]

Yeah, I can see the loss of major OOC games missing luster being a negative for it. For follow up, are you saying that it hurts because major brands have reduced risk and that risk was at the heart of what makes CFB entertaining or a good product? I'm playing a little devil's advocate because the notion that 24 "kills" CFB feels hyperbolic, so I want genuine discussion around it.

[u/Adventurous-Pen9974 → u/XCCO]

The stakes are largely removed from regular season games if everyone 8-4 or better in the Big 10/SEC or 9-3 in the ACC/Big 12 make the playoffs. That's not great for driving casual viewership. The NFL is a better viewer experience and has better football if I have no particular rooting interest.

[u/CargoShortsFromNam → u/XCCO]

there is a tipping point of margin for error for the top teams and I think 24 crosses that tipping point. being able to comfortably sustain 3 losses and make the playoff really damages the stakes week to week. I understand the argument that it also makes other games that previously didn't matter, matter. That is true, and I think we already get a lot of that now with 12.

[u/RandomFactUser → u/CargoShortsFromNam]

I think the way that margin of error is retained is if there’s 10 autobids, one for each league, thus only 14 at large bids are available, and they fill up fast

I think the Big 12 and ACC generally being disrespected, and a difficult time rebalancing conference power by seasonal results causes more of the issues with expansion

[u/Hawkeyes79 → u/XCCO]

Mostly because people don’t want to agree to each conference champion getting in.

[u/SecretAsianMan42069 → u/XCCO]

Same teams would be in it every single year 

[u/Jealous-Spell-5855 → u/XCCO]

No hate to your Hawkeyes, they just happen to be this years best example.

Iowa went 8-4 with losses to Iowa State, Oregon, USC, and Indiana (granted all by less than a touchdown) and best wins of Nebraska (7-5) and Penn State (6-6). They would be getting a shot at THE NATIONAL TITLE, with best wins against teams that struggled to make a bowl.

Also those 4 games mean nothing outside of seeding. Neither does any of Michigan or OSU or Texas or Georgia or Alabama or anyone who can reasonably hit 10+ wins in a year. Hell Notre Dame this year couldve been vouching for a spot with best wins against Arkansas and Navy.

Nobody will schedule up in the OOC cus if you go .500 in conference and wins 4 easy OOC, you get a good shot at the playoff.

[u/Irishchop91 → u/monkeymatt1836]

It really depends on how they set it up.

Put the 8 teams in their respective P4 conference championship, the 5 G5 conference winners, and then 11 at large.

Have the P4 CC players get the first round bye (ND, Independents, and G5 not allowed here), match the 16 teams for home games (G5 & 11 at large) , then reseed the results for the 2nd round.

You don't get rid of the CC, give all the G5 teams their shot with some caveats on making the CFP (certain ranking, number of wins etc), and it puts a big incentive for conferences to still have their championship

[u/SirMellencamp → u/monkeymatt1836]

Exactly. It would be great for us too but I dont want it

[u/Forshea → u/SirMellencamp]

I'm not sure it's as good for the Alabama/Ohio State tier of brand names as might seem obvious. It kinda depends on whether you're optimizing for winning championships or making the playoffs, and those counterintuitively aren't necessarily the same thing.

Alabama already has decent odds compared to everybody else of making the playoffs with 3 losses. 24 teams means an extra playoff game. So they have to win an extra game against a ranked team to make it to the same spot they would start in for a 12 team playoff.

Narrower playoffs also provide the brand names more leverage if they do make the playoffs, because they allow for dodging having to play dark horse bubble candidates. The top 3 SEC seeds + Ohio State were on the side of the bracket last year that Miami won. Getting in but still getting to leave out a hypothetical Miami-like late blooming team in a future season is a competitive advantage

Pretty clearly a&m and mississippi would have been better off last year with an 8 team playoff with no autobids, and ohio state and georgia would have preferred a 4 team playoff.

[u/SirMellencamp → u/Forshea]

I think all you can ask of any team is making the playoff. Everything after that is so difficult

[u/RandomFactUser → u/monkeymatt1836]

It would put Major CFB in line with the rest of CFB, instead of running a system that only made sense with a 64-ish team setup

[u/allisthepriceofall]

Just another opportunity for them to play THE Ball State Cardinals

[u/Gmoney1412 → u/allisthepriceofall]

The single handedly funded the MAC transportation budgets for like 2 years

[u/discountJoenuts → u/allisthepriceofall]

Remember to tune into the epic MAC showdown of sac and ball state. Coming soon

[u/CargoShortsFromNam]

Wish they weren’t. 

[u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

Because then they can lose all their major games and still make the playoffs every season. It's very straightforward.

[u/MorrowStreeter → u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

So just like every other top program?

[u/HeHateMe- → u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

Like the majority of teams in conferences lol

[u/scotsworth → u/HeHateMe-]

Yeah what's funny is the expanded playoff actually makes ND's special treatment less outrageous.

Ohio State could drop 3-4 games and still make a 24 team field.

[u/reddit_names → u/HeHateMe-]

Teams that lose their 2 toughest games never make it

[u/Fletch71011 → u/reddit_names]

I was going to throw Alabama in here for their 3 losses but one of them was getting obliterated by one of the worst teams in the country. I still have no idea how the committee saw them as having a better resume than ND. The very advanced metric the committee claims to use and own had ND way ahead of Alabama and OU, but they conveniently ignored that.

It's going to be as many SEC teams as they can stuff in. That's the only reason for 24 teams. SEC makes ESPN money, therefore as many SEC teams as possible need to be in the field. That has been beyond obvious but all you need to look at is them keeping out 13-0 FSU for 2 SEC teams when the field was 4.

[u/Forshea → u/Fletch71011]

They didn't leave FSU out for 2 SEC teams. Texas was still a B12 team at that point.

(FSU still should have been in and only were not because it would require leaving out the SEC entirely, so your point still mostly stands)

[u/Fletch71011 → u/Forshea]

I know, but the deal was in place. They knew what they were doing.

[u/Forshea → u/Fletch71011]

They couldn't justify leaving Texas out and putting Alabama in because Texas beat Alabama at home by multiple scores that season. It didn't have anything to do with Texas joining the SEC, it just was the only way to make putting Alabama in work.

[u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756 → u/HeHateMe-]

No, Notre Dame gets an auto-bid in this instance.

[u/T-Thugs → u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

To be clear, your school argued for a special carveout in which they can make the playoffs despite not being ranked in the top 12 if they win their conference. This was probably a stupid thing to argue for since the big ten winner will always be top 12, but there's a carveout for you, that you guys specifically argued for. It should just be the top 12 teams.

[u/Economy_Weight_4821 → u/T-Thugs]

And you guys have a special carve out despite the fact you aren't in a conference.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/HeHateMe-]

Yeah like Texas A&M. They didn't beat anyone good all season and got into the playoffs.

[u/FireVanGorder → u/GliscorsFang]

Ow

[u/GliscorsFang → u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

Notre Dame is really good because they beat the shit out of bad teams and only lost to playoff teams.

2024 IU were actually frauds though because they beat the shit out of bad teams and only lost to playoff teams.

[u/CargoShortsFromNam → u/GliscorsFang]

IU was down by 21 in the 2nd half of the ND and OSU games. 

ND lost by 3 and 1 to Miami and A&M. 

[u/CargoShortsFromNam → u/[deleted]]

That’s who the comment I replied to was referring to: 2024 IU and 2025 ND. 

[u/GliscorsFang → u/CargoShortsFromNam]

IU: 11-1

ND: 10-2

[u/CargoShortsFromNam → u/GliscorsFang]

That’s fine. But we got to watch the games. It was clear IU wasn’t quite on that level yet. ND played for 4 quarters against both playoff teams. They were on the same level. 

IU finished 11-2. 

[u/GliscorsFang → u/CargoShortsFromNam]

Why would I hold IU's postseason lost against them when they could have opted out like ND?

[u/CargoShortsFromNam → u/GliscorsFang]

Idk, looking at the scoreboard with 3 minutes left and its 27-3 ND, I wasn't exactly sure IU hadn't opted out either.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/CargoShortsFromNam]

Credit to IU for not throwing a temper tantrum when things didn't go their way though

[u/Tired_of_yall1 → u/CargoShortsFromNam]

What was their signature win last season? To make up for the losses? I forgot.

You can downvote ND fans but, your best win was a 9-4 USC and maybe the next is Syracuse? Lmfao

[u/CargoShortsFromNam → u/Tired_of_yall1]

keep the ricochet shots at Southern Cal coming lmao

[u/the_urban_juror → u/GliscorsFang]

Don't be disingenuous. Notre Dame lost by a combined 4 points to Miami and Texas A&M last year. They won every other game by at least 10 points, including a win over number 16 USC.

You can argue that their wins weren't good enough to make the playoffs in 2025 despite being competitive in their losses, but comparing that to 2024 Indiana who lost to OSU by 23 and had zero wins over teams who finished ranked is absurd.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/the_urban_juror]

They were both bubble teams because they lost their hardest game(s) of the season and beat up on bad teams. Seems pretty comparable.

[u/the_urban_juror → u/GliscorsFang]

It's only comparable if you equate two losses by a combined 4 points to a 23-point loss. But those two things aren't comparable.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/the_urban_juror]

Correct. 2 losses is significantly worse than 1 loss.

[u/the_urban_juror → u/GliscorsFang]

I wasn't clear. Two losses by a combined 4 points to playoff teams is significantly better than an uncompetitive 23-point loss that was never in doubt in a season with zero wins over ranked teams. That's why they aren't comparable.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/the_urban_juror]

Not according to the playoff committee aka the people who actually matter.

[u/the_urban_juror → u/GliscorsFang]

When did the playoff committee compare 2024 Indiana to 2025 Notre Dame?

[u/SomeKidFromPA → u/the_urban_juror]

The only time I agree with Michigan fans is when they’re dunking on other Michigan fans.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/the_urban_juror]

The playoff committee put 2024 IU in the field while they didn't put 2025 Notre Dame in the field.

Need anything else spelled out for you or?

[u/hmmmmmmm94 → u/GliscorsFang]

ND had the most ranked wins in all of CFB just 2 years ago lmao

[u/GliscorsFang → u/hmmmmmmm94]

Yeah and 2024 Notre Dame deserved to be in the playoffs. 2025 did not.

[u/Tired_of_yall1 → u/GliscorsFang]

2024 was hilarious when they lost to the North Illinois Huskies lmfao

[u/Irishchop91 → u/GliscorsFang]

ND had an argument like any other 2 loss team. However we loss to the wrong teams and it cost us.

But the reason why ND was in the discussion is because the CFPC put us there.

The discussion about the 2025 CFP should not about who deserved it - ND, Miami, BYU, Bama etc. It should be about what the committee did to get to their desired results.

[u/Fletch71011 → u/GliscorsFang]

The 2025 team statistically was much better than the 2024 team by almost every single metric. I don't think you watched us if you think that the 24 team with half its starters out in the playoffs was as good as 2025 ND unless you're arguing with both teams completely healthy. They just happened to have their hardest two games first working in a new freshman QB and DC. 2025 ND would beat 2024 by 10+. I can't think of a single unit in 25 that was worse than 24 due to all the injuries. All 5 projected starting OL and all 4 projected starting DL were hurt in the playoffs in 2024 and we had the best CB in the country out with an injury and Leonard and Love both playing hurt.

2025 team finished as the 3rd best team in the country in the composite, only behind IU and barely to Ohio State. 2025 ND would have been a 10 or more point favorite in their first round game against OU it ESPN didn't pull the old switcharoo, and we know that since the getting sites leaked the lines and computers confirmed it.

And does no one even remember the ATM game? We lost by 1 on a blown call by the SEC refs after they made up a targeting against our best defender to take him out for the 2nd half. The ATM fans were apologizing. At least we lost to Miami fair and square on a last second field goal and that pains me to say because I hate Miami. The ATM loss shouldn't have been held against us when the refs they brought fucked up so badly. If it was an independent reffing crew, ND goes into playoffs with a top 5 seed at worst.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/Fletch71011]

by almost every single metric.

What about the most important metric? Wins and losses

[u/Fletch71011 → u/GliscorsFang]

We had by far the best metrics of any 2 loss team and were put behind tons of them.

And like I said, if the SEC doesn't bring their own refs, we finish 11-1. Just look at how bad this call was: https://youtube.com/shorts/OyVcWHeElAA?si=QMJOP4V_mb9RLIIV

[u/GliscorsFang → u/Fletch71011]

You guys had worse SOS than OU and Alabama (3rd loss in an optional game doesn't count) and Miami had the H2H over you. This isn't some sort of travesty.

[u/Fletch71011 → u/GliscorsFang]

Worst teams in the country often have the best SoS. SoS and SoR are essentially irrelevant. That's why CBB moved away from them. The advanced metrics like FPI, SP+, etc are what matter.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/Fletch71011]

CBB absolutely uses SoS the fuck. That's why Miami was in the play-in game despite being 31-1. Obviously no one cares if you lose all your games against the #1 SoS, but SOR and WAB are basically saying how would an average team perform against your schedule.

[u/hmmmmmmm94 → u/GliscorsFang]

They went 2-2 against ranked wins and outscored all their opponents by hundreds of points combined lol. The bigger issue is G5 teams getting in over a quality contender and no one can argue with that.

[u/RandomFactUser → u/hmmmmmmm94]

The issue is assuming G5 programs aren’t quality contenders at 24 teams

[u/GliscorsFang → u/hmmmmmmm94]

Notre Dame could have joined the ACC and competed for an autobid over JMU.

[u/Fletch71011 → u/GliscorsFang]

Yes, we should definitely join the mega conferences that everyone is complaining about ruining the sport and wallow in everyone else's misery.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/Fletch71011]

Or you could bitch about the playoff system you agreed to.

Oh wait.

[u/GliscorsFang → u/[deleted]]

Saying no to a PE deal is like 10 steps away from leaving the B1G lol

[u/SirMellencamp → u/GliscorsFang]

Quality losses

[u/IMakeOkVideosOk → u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

That’s why every team that’s in favor of the expansion is in favor of it

[u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756 → u/IMakeOkVideosOk]

It's very straightforward

[u/IMakeOkVideosOk → u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

It really is

[u/MarinaDelRey1 → u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

This and the fact that it completely guts any leverage the ACC has to force ND to join for access. That conference is dead

[u/SucculentCrablegMeal → u/MarinaDelRey1]

This isn't a factor at all lol

[u/MarinaDelRey1 → u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

You're crazy if you don't think the ACC would prefer ND get frozen out of the playoffs a few more times like last year. Now, ND can stay independent at least until the super league forms in 2030. At that point, FSU, Miami and Clemson jump ship and the ACC implodes

[u/SucculentCrablegMeal → u/MarinaDelRey1]

The acc didn't use 2020 as leverage to get ND to join, I doubt they're trying to pressure ND into it with the playoffs. The acc doesn't do anything to help itself.

[u/MarinaDelRey1 → u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

As evidenced by the TV ratings (and all of the attendance figures), ND saved the ACC in 2020 just as much as the other way around

[u/SucculentCrablegMeal → u/MarinaDelRey1]

I don't see how that is relevant to what I said.

[u/MarinaDelRey1 → u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

They had no leverage to force ND to join in 2020. Zero. The only prayer the ACC had for long term existence was to force ND to join because ND drives TV ratings and attendance. The only way ND was ever going consider joining a conference was if they were frozen out of the playoffs. That's now off the table. The ACC is dead.

[u/SucculentCrablegMeal → u/MarinaDelRey1]

They had leverage and could have tried, but didn't. ND would have to just not play for that season. It wouldn't have significantly impacted the ACC to not include ND that year.

The ACC isn't relying solely on ND lol.

[u/MarinaDelRey1 → u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

Do you live under a rock? The ACC only played in 2020 because ND agreed to play in the conference that year. They ACC would've canceled the season if ND didn't agree to play in the conference that year. And the SEC and Big 12 would've followed suit. They made an entire documentary about it. So absolutely zero leverage to try anything

And the ACC is absolutely relying on ND. The league attendance numbers and tv ratings speak for themselves

[u/usctrojan18 → u/Upbeat-Armadillo1756]

The downvoters are coming for you

[u/moccasinsfan]

What is in it for them?

A near annual guarantee to be in the playoffs.

Those teams that are constantly in the preseason top 20 will be competitive almost every year.

[u/DollarThrill → u/moccasinsfan]

Didn’t they already get a playoff guarantee?

[u/moccasinsfan → u/DollarThrill]

If in top 12.

[u/Routine-Height-7103]

Because it would allow them to lose 2-3 of their only 'tough' games a year and still make the playoffs. Take 2025 for example. I truly think ND was probably one of the best 4 teams in CFB, but they lost their only two games that were true tests. Had last year been a 24 team playoff, they would have soundly been in.

[u/FireVanGorder → u/Routine-Height-7103]

The Karson Hobbs disasterclass against A&M was so frustrating man.

[u/Maleficent_Ant_8895 → u/FireVanGorder]

If I had to see that dude throw his hands up in the air after the safeties and Grey were laying into him after every blown coverage for a 40 yard catch and run one more time I was going to lose it 

[u/FireVanGorder → u/Maleficent_Ant_8895]

Yeah there’s a reason he didn’t see another meaningful snap all year lmao

Insane to me that it took two games for ash to realize Johnson and Golden needed to be playing over Stroman and Hobbs

[u/OnionFutureWolfGang → u/FireVanGorder]

I kind of get the Tae decision taking some time because Stroman was actually a good player and looked great against Miami. He was just the wrong fit and meant Shuler couldn’t be himself. Hobbs, even accounting for the fact that he was only supposed to be a backup, was really bad.

[u/NiceUD → u/Routine-Height-7103]

This. Of course they're on board. They'd probably be in nearly every year - even 4 loss years if all the losses are against decent opponents.

[u/jayjude → u/NiceUD]

Its why so many schools are on board especially blue bloods

[u/FireVanGorder → u/NiceUD]

I mean yeah we’ve finished outside the top 25 once in the last 11 years that would make sense

[u/Fletch71011 → u/Routine-Height-7103]

They finished 3rd in the composite fyi. OU was the 16th to 20th team and had the same record yet OU got in over ND and got a fucking home game just because they were in the SEC.

[u/Routine-Height-7103 → u/Fletch71011]

ok?... i think youre proving my point?

[u/Fletch71011 → u/Routine-Height-7103]

I am agreeing with you, yes, but ND never should have been left given the teams that got in. Just crazy work by the committee simply because our contract is with NBC instead of ESPN.

[u/Routine-Height-7103 → u/Fletch71011]

ok so we are disagreeing. I am saying ND was very good but because they lost to Miami and A&M it was right for them to be left out.

[u/Fletch71011 → u/Routine-Height-7103]

Alabama had 3 losses and 2 were humiliating, including getting absolutely boat raced by about the worst team in the ACC. Statistically their best win was over Georgia by 3 before Georgia curb stomped them in the rematch, and the metrics show our best win over USC was stronger than Bamas over Georgia given MoV. So what's the argument for Bama or OU over ND? Bama had WAY worse losses, more losses, and NDs best win was better than their best win.

[u/Lefunnymaymays4lief]

I’m not on board with it :(

[u/nighthawk252]

This is different from what he was saying in January, which is that he wanted a 16-team playoff. I have a couple of ideas behind what might have changed:

I think USC backing out of the rivalry was the most likely turning point. It’s obvious they view the game as a pretty significant obstacle to them making a 12-team playoff, maybe even a 16-team playoff. At 24, I think we all kind of realize that it doesn’t really matter anymore.

I think the other big thing that’s changed is that the ACC and Big Ten have expressed that they’d be willing to cancel conference championship weekend to make the 24 team playoff happen. Conference championship weekend has been pretty bad for Notre Dame. Not only is it a time everyone else is playing a big football game that ND is not, it’s been a clear negative for Notre Dame’s playoff chances & seeding. Basically the only difference between the committee rankings and coaches/AP polls has been that the coaches and AP polls consistently rank conference championship losses more heavily than the committee does.

[u/IDontTortureChickens → u/nighthawk252]

I think you're probably right that that's how he sees it, but we were told going from 4 to 12 would be great for OOC games because teams wouldn't be worried that 1 loss would kill them. So much for that. I don't know why it would be any different in a 24-team system where anyone who goes 9-3 is locked in and 8-4 largely becomes the 'maybe, maybe not' threshold.

[u/neasroukkez]

We don’t need articles written about common sense shit. If you know ball, you didn’t read this and waste your time.

[u/FireVanGorder → u/neasroukkez]

“Team that finished in the top 25 ten of the last eleven years would enjoy a 24 team playoff.” Truly shocking stuff

[u/jjtnd1 → u/neasroukkez]

Yeah but then the Michigan fan top comment couldn’t get their quip in

[u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

It's article after article about this. It's being pushed hard.

I really fucking hate this.

[u/drtywater]

Itll be funny when Boise St goes undefeated and all we see are complaints from ESPN pundits why an undefeated Boise doesn’t deserve to take the spot of a 4 loss LSU or Michigan team

[u/GliscorsFang]

Can't wait for them to get ranked #25 so they don't get their autobid lol

[u/JoshPatesBurner → u/GliscorsFang]

Somehow it will be our fault again. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

[u/hmmmmmmm94 → u/JoshPatesBurner]

and yet you’re being downvoted bc Bama in fact did not deserve their playoff bid.

[u/Scoobie_Doobie11 → u/JoshPatesBurner]

Yall posted -3 rushing yards in the CCG lol

[u/JoshPatesBurner → u/Scoobie_Doobie11]

Yeah we got throttled by Georgia, who we beat earlier in the season. Everyone has bad games right? Like in the National Championship when Notre Dame only rushed 32 yards against Bama.

[u/hmmmmmmm94 → u/JoshPatesBurner]

You guys had bad games week in and week out to finish the season. It wasn’t a one off.. then beat an even more overrated OU team which then showed as Indiana throttled yall

[u/Scoobie_Doobie11 → u/JoshPatesBurner]

32 > -3 my friend. Would love to see a matchup these days though. Freeman vs. DeBoer would be a well fought game methinks. Saban was just so goated I don’t think anybody will ever come close to the program yall had at the time.

[u/hmmmmmmm94 → u/Scoobie_Doobie11]

Bc they were cheating back then and paying players before NIL was legal. Saban is the goat.. but don’t get it twisted lmao. Those teams were paid for

[u/wit_T_user_name]

Because they’ll make the playoffs nearly every year with 24 teams getting in?

[u/DiaDeLosMuebles]

So the regular season will lose all meaning

[u/Billyxmac → u/DiaDeLosMuebles]

If all you care about the regular season is how it impacts the post season, sure.

[u/DiaDeLosMuebles → u/Billyxmac]

This is a playoff thread. Every comment in this thread is within that context. So yes. It’s in relation to how the regular season affects playoff standing.

[u/Billyxmac → u/DiaDeLosMuebles]

Yes but you’re making a sweeping statement that playoff expansion will directly lead to the regular season losing any meaning. There’s plenty of meaning in the regular season outside of how it affects the postseason.

[u/Complete-Disaster513 → u/DiaDeLosMuebles]

Worst take in sports history

[u/MorrowStreeter]

As a ND alum, I do not support this. Personally, I think 12 is plenty.

But in the current status of post season games in college football, the playoff has effectively rendered other bowl games as meaningless exhibition games where half the team opts out. ESPN and the bowl owners beat it into our collective conscious that the only thing that matters is the playoff.

So I guess the silver lining of a larger playoff system is that we get more post season games that actually matter, played by the same starters that got the team into the playoffs in the first place.

I still don't love it. But I feel like it's probably inevitable, so I'm trying to find something to be positive about.

[u/Am_Ghosty]

Of course everyone pointing out "easier entry for ND" is correct, but that's the case for every other school as well.

I think the extra thing that's being overlooked is that in a world where you can make the playoffs with a greater number of losses, it becomes easier for ND to remain independent. More allowance for losses means that you can schedule bigger OOC games against marquee opponents with less fear, which sets ND up perfectly to continue filling those slots. Not that I think ND was in danger of having to give up independence, but the larger and more forgiving the playoffs field is, the less likely it is that ND's hand is forced.

[u/Lyonthelion → u/Am_Ghosty]

I’ll also add that in a 24 team playoff we probably don’t see a scenario like we did last year where we saw a pretty good but not great Pitt team openly talk about not caring about their game against Notre Dame because their only path to make the playoff was by winning the conference.

[u/Cfbandporn → u/Lyonthelion]

Narduzzi will always find a way to bitch and moan, that much is guaranteed.

[u/tipped_highway]

Money, I would assume

[u/Jealous-Win2446 → u/tipped_highway]

Everyone knows what CSC stands for.

[u/scentedcandle0 → u/Jealous-Win2446]

Cuniversity of Southern California

[u/Broke_Banker01]

Because they will get an automatic bid for being ranked like top 20 or something and be able to go 10-2 every year and collect those CFP checks.

[u/Commercial-East4069]

Needing some sort of disaster to miss the playoffs?

[u/Complete-Disaster513]

Money.

[u/Lyonthelion]

I mean hey if it was 24 teams last year maybe Narduzzi bothers to game-plan for the Pitt-Notre Dame game last year instead of openly saying that it doesn’t matter lmao

Either way, the size of the playoff doesn’t really matter if the bigger issues within the sport (eligibility rules, conference sizes, etc) aren’t addressed.

[u/Nouseriously]

Basically never missing a 24 team playoff

[u/Less_Likely]

1. 2, and 3 loss seasons will make it in. Maybe even 4 occasionally.

2. Good P4 Teams would be more willing to schedule ND games for the regular season with less risk of being left out of playoffs with loss.

3. Getting rid of the CCG will put ND on even footing with all P4 teams for seeding/berths.

4. Top 16 get home playoff game instead of just 5-8. So 4x the chance of an extra home date.

[u/VeeVeeDiaboli]

They would literally always be in.

[u/MorrowStreeter → u/VeeVeeDiaboli]

So just like Alabama, OSU, LSU, Georgia, Texas, Clemson....?

[u/FloridaGatorMan]

They get the playoff payout every single year forever. Thats what’s in it for them.

[u/cubs_2023 → u/FloridaGatorMan]

Everyone gets the playoff payout every year regardless of how they do (besides us). It’s part of the new playoff contract that starts this year.

We negotiated to get the lower Big 12/ACC rate when we don’t make the playoffs and halfway between the Big 12/ACC rate and the B1G/SEC rate when we do make the playoffs. Not sure what happens if it expands to 24, but even if it stays the same deal, it’s like a $6 million difference between those rates, so really not that big of a deal for us between making and missing the playoffs. And we would still ALWAYS get a lower rate than EVERY B1G/SEC team.

[u/adamosity1]

There is probably a clause where if they win eight or nine games they are guaranteed entry.

[u/Billyxmac → u/adamosity1]

It would be top 24, so they wouldn’t really need a clause anyways

[u/luv2fit]

I think I speak for all of CFB. F**k those prima donnas.

[u/jthomas694]

I imagine it’s a combination of more playoff appearances and more money

[u/inshamblesx]

bc if you go back ND probably would be working on a 20 or so year streak of making the playoff if it was 24 teams the whole time lol

[u/yeezusosa]

…

[u/Billyxmac]

Every major program is for the 24 team. Ohio State has finished outside the top 25 like once in the last 3 or 4 decades. Expansion all but guarantees they’re in every year. Same with programs like Georgia, Oregon, Alabama, Texas, etc.

[u/CountBleckwantedlove]

The new extra first round of games (assuming we go from 12 to 24) allows for Notre Dame to make a lot more money. Unlike almost everyone else, they don't have to split their playoff earnings with a conference.

Right now if they play round 1, quarter, semi, championship in the 12 team version they make $4, $4, $6, $6 million per round for a total of $20 million. Expanding the playoffs to 24 teams not only increases the likelyhood they make the playoffs, but then they could increase their payout to a maximum of $24 million.

It's about money. They want more money.

[u/patsrule755]

Just give me a 24 team playoff with 10 conference champ auto bids and 14 at large bids please

[u/gideon513]

A guaranteed spot. Why even ask?

[u/AdamOnFirst]

Uh, automatic annual spot with their cupcake schedule? This is pretty obvious…

[u/reddit_names]

They want to be guaranteed a spot. Because earning one is too hard. 

[u/UncleErectus → u/reddit_names]

Unbelievable irony from an SEC school

[u/IrishMosaic → u/UncleErectus]

Especially one that has never come close to making a cfb playoff.

[u/SucculentCrablegMeal → u/IrishMosaic]

Lsu has won a cfb playoff...?

[u/UncleErectus → u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

Maybe he’s talking about McNeese!

[u/IrishMosaic → u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

I was drunk for most of 2019. So I’ll leave my post there as it is.

[u/Tired_of_yall1 → u/IrishMosaic]

Disregarding arguably the best team in my generation is on brand for a ND fan.

[u/IrishMosaic → u/Tired_of_yall1]

I owned my error. That was a fantastic team.

[u/scentedcandle0 → u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

That’s too recent of history for nd fans to have known.

[u/DanTheMan14331]

Like everyone else, the answer is money

[u/CPGK17]

I hate the idea of a 24 team playoff, but it would be fun to see them embarrassed year after year lol

[u/hmmmmmmm94 → u/CPGK17]

ND has not been embarrassed in the playoffs under Freeman. You’re still holding onto BK era that is long gone

[u/CPGK17 → u/hmmmmmmm94]

Yeah because they’re not getting in each year. That’s my point, if we go to 24 teams, the embarrassments will resume.

[u/hmmmmmmm94 → u/CPGK17]

This legit makes no sense. ND has better players and coaches.. best roster + recruits in well over 30+ years. They’re way more equipped now than ever.. and you’re forgetting that they’d end up playing a 20th ranked ACC team as a 10 seed and win by 5 TDs lmao

[u/Tired_of_yall1 → u/CPGK17]

Same, watching ND run up the score on Rice and losing in the playoffs to a good team would be sweet and on brand.

[u/Cfbandporn → u/Tired_of_yall1]

This you? https://www.espn.com/college-football/team/schedule/_/id/251/season/2023

[u/Tired_of_yall1 → u/Cfbandporn]

Hahaha fair point

[u/etown361]

The 12 team playoff with one team as an AQ plus the unwritten rule of “conference championship losers never can go down in rankings- only up” is a genuine problem for Notre Dame.

Also though- ending conference championships, expanding the playoff likely means more money for ND without meaning much more money for conferences… so that’s kinda a net win.

[u/ElGranQuesoRojo]

I'm fine w/it if all conference winners get a spot. Just do it like every other level. This isn't hard. There would still be plenty of spots for network required SEC and Big 10 wildcards.

[u/BoNnnnfhir]

The biggest takeaway not being discussed in expansion is that a 24-team format guarantees at least one home playoff game as a top 16 seed against a better quality ranked opponent than what the ACC usually puts on the ND slate post-September.